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imaMacedonian
imaMacedonian
Are you "yes we can" or was that all about you and not freedom
Jan 1 2009, 5:42 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 1 2009, 5:42 PM EST
So Yes We Can
& YES W HAVE SO NOW SHOW US YOUR GIUDED AHND TO HOW THIS INSLAMENT OF INJUST IS GOING TO BE CORECTED AS HUMANS HAVE TITLES TO LAND THAT WAS THERES AND NO ISNT THIS ACT IS UNHUMAN AND NEEDS TO BE FIXED ASAP COMPANSATION OF SOME KIND NEEDS TO BE GIVEN BY THE GREEK GOVERMNET TO THE mACEDONIAN PEOPLE THAT WHERE TOLD TO LEVE THERE LAND AND TO NEVER RETURN R FACE DEATH
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BrandonE
1. RE: Are you "yes we can" or was that all about you and not freedom
Jan 1 2009, 7:43 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 1 2009, 7:43 PM EST
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Petros_Houhoulis
Petros_Houhoulis
2. RE: Are you "yes we can" or was that all about you and not freedom
Jan 1 2009, 8:22 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 1 2009, 8:22 PM EST
"So Yes We Can
& YES W HAVE SO NOW SHOW US YOUR GIUDED AHND TO HOW THIS INSLAMENT OF INJUST IS GOING TO BE CORECTED AS HUMANS HAVE TITLES TO LAND THAT WAS THERES AND NO ISNT THIS ACT IS UNHUMAN AND NEEDS TO BE FIXED ASAP COMPANSATION OF SOME KIND NEEDS TO BE GIVEN BY THE GREEK GOVERMNET TO THE mACEDONIAN PEOPLE THAT WHERE TOLD TO LEVE THERE LAND AND TO NEVER RETURN R FACE DEATH"
Your folks were caught cooperating with the Bulgarians during the WWII (Caltcheffs' infamous Ohrana), who were in turn collaborators of the NAZIs (Greece was divided between Bulgaria, Italy and Germany during WWII)

After the WWII your folks transformed overnight from Fascist collaborators into Communists (!?!) but they were eventually expelled from Greece along with many other Communists by the end of the Greek civil war.

In the end, your folks are barred from returning because the expulsion of all of the populations that were accused of collaboration with the NAZI regimes and collaborators has been permanent in all cases, whether this is Chechoslovakia (Benes decrees), Poland, (a portion of Germany was ceded to Poland forever) Finland (which lost a portion of its' territory to Russia) e.t.c.

Below you can find a quote by your own Andrew Rossos (one of your refugees turned historian in Canada) who half-heartedly admits your collaboration with the Italian, German and Bulgarian occupation authorities, and Vancho Mihailovs' IMRO (IMRO has been a terrorist organization responsible for the assassinations of the Bulgarian prime minister Aleksandar Stamboliyski at 1923 and king Alexander of Yugoslavia and French foreign minister Louis Barthou at 1934).

http://makedonika.wordpress.com/2008/07/15/incompatible-allies-greek-communism-and-macedonian-nationalism-in-the-civil-war-in-greece-1943-1949/

"In Macedonia, however, the KKE and EAM-ELAS faced stiff competition for the allegiance of the Macedonians...
...Many responded instead to the calls of the Italian, German, and Bulgarian occupation authorities and of Vanco Mihailov’s Internal Macedonian Revolutionary Organization (IMRO), who promised them liberation from Greek rule in the form of a “free,” “autonomous” “independent” or “united” Macedonian state..."

If your own propaganda proves you NAZI collaborators... even a little bit..
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samuil
samuil
3. RE: Are you "yes we can" or was that all about you and not freedom
Jan 2 2009, 3:16 AM EST | Post edited: Jan 2 2009, 3:16 AM EST
"Your folks were caught cooperating with the Bulgarians during the WWII (Caltcheffs' infamous Ohrana), who were in turn collaborators of the NAZIs (Greece was divided between Bulgaria, Italy and Germany during WWII)

After the WWII your folks transformed overnight from Fascist collaborators into Communists (!?!) but they were eventually expelled from Greece along with many other Communists by the end of the Greek civil war.

In the end, your folks are barred from returning because the expulsion of all of the populations that were accused of collaboration with the NAZI regimes and collaborators has been permanent in all cases, whether this is Chechoslovakia (Benes decrees), Poland, (a portion of Germany was ceded to Poland forever) Finland (which lost a portion of its' territory to Russia) e.t.c.

Below you can find a quote by your own Andrew Rossos (one of your refugees turned historian in Canada) who half-heartedly admits your collaboration with the Italian, German and Bulgarian occupation authorities, and Vancho Mihailovs' IMRO (IMRO has been a terrorist organization responsible for the assassinations of the Bulgarian prime minister Aleksandar Stamboliyski at 1923 and king Alexander of Yugoslavia and French foreign minister Louis Barthou at 1934).

http://makedonika.wordpress.com/2008/07/15/incompatible-allies-greek-communism-and-macedonian-nationalism-in-the-civil-war-in-greece-1943-1949/

"In Macedonia, however, the KKE and EAM-ELAS faced stiff competition for the allegiance of the Macedonians...
...Many responded instead to the calls of the Italian, German, and Bulgarian occupation authorities and of Vanco Mihailov’s Internal Macedonian Revolutionary Organization (IMRO), who promised them liberation from Greek rule in the form of a “free,” “autonomous” “independent” or “united” Macedonian state..."

If your own propaganda proves you NAZI collaborators... even a little bit.."
IMRO main goal was the unification of Macedonia region with Bulgaria!
Stamboliiski was killed because he was the firs minister that started a policy without the liberation of macedonia as main goal. That was his crusual mistake. He was acussed as antibulgarian and his death penalty was "signed" by IMRO.
King Alexander of Serbia was killed because of his represions and killings of bulgarians in Macedonia in his efforts to serbise the population! HE killed thousands of bulgarians only for their refusal to identify themselves as serbs!
The same reason is for the french minister because of the french politics - dangerous for the preservation of the bulgarian macedonia!

Nothing of this will happen if Bulgaria was not teared in 5 pieces after the Berlin threaty in 1878! All the wars after that as for the unification of the Bulgarian nation! Imagine 3 portions of land - given to the nebhors - with 90 % homogen bulgarian population! The only way to keep this lands is to kill or banish this people! And that was what Greece, Serbia and ROmania did! They killed and banished bulgarians for half a century. And after that they colonize with its own people from different parts of their lands!
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Petros_Houhoulis
Petros_Houhoulis
4. RE: Are you "yes we can" or was that all about you and not freedom
Jan 2 2009, 4:39 AM EST | Post edited: Jan 2 2009, 4:39 AM EST
"IMRO main goal was the unification of Macedonia region with Bulgaria!
Stamboliiski was killed because he was the firs minister that started a policy without the liberation of macedonia as main goal. That was his crusual mistake. He was acussed as antibulgarian and his death penalty was "signed" by IMRO.
King Alexander of Serbia was killed because of his represions and killings of bulgarians in Macedonia in his efforts to serbise the population! HE killed thousands of bulgarians only for their refusal to identify themselves as serbs!
The same reason is for the french minister because of the french politics - dangerous for the preservation of the bulgarian macedonia!

Nothing of this will happen if Bulgaria was not teared in 5 pieces after the Berlin threaty in 1878! All the wars after that as for the unification of the Bulgarian nation! Imagine 3 portions of land - given to the nebhors - with 90 % homogen bulgarian population! The only way to keep this lands is to kill or banish this people! And that was what Greece, Serbia and ROmania did! They killed and banished bulgarians for half a century. And after that they colonize with its own people from different parts of their lands!"
So you admit that you killed your own prime minister because some minority (IMRO) didn't approve his policies, right? What about the majority who voted for Stamboliyski? Were they traitors as well?

Anyway, it is pointless to discuss this issue since you cannot provide that the people whom you consider as Bulgarian actually felt Bulgarians. Some of the greatest leaders of the IMRO were Vlachs (and therefore not Bulgarians) like Pitu Guli. Those fellas preferred a Switzerland-like Macedonia rather than a Greater Bulgaria and IMRO's stance was ambivalent on the issue, until it was split to those who promoted the Bulgarian ideal against those who preferred a Macedonian state composed of Bulgarians, Greeks, Turks, Jews, Vlachs e.t.c. In the end, some were fooled to think that they are Macedonians of the Ancient breed!!!

You have to wake up and - much like your forefathers - realize some day that very few of those "Bulgarians" wished to be citizens of Bulgaria, and they realized that those without a national consciousness required some coercion to this end. This coercion was frequently violent - like the execution of patriarchist priests - and this violence turned the Greek state against you. Your mistake was the abandonment of the peaceful effort (education) and the adoption of violent solution against not only the Muslims, but also your fellow Christians. This was simply impossible, and all the Russian support in the world was not enough to help your cause.

The massacres and the expulsions of the populations of the former Ottoman empire are a very common sight in the modern Balkans, even as recently as the Yugoslav tragedy of the 1990's. The rise of nationalism out of a world that defined itself out of religious convictions for two millenia was an inevitable conclusion. Still, you cannot claim that you suffered more than the Armenians (1.5 m dead) or the Greeks (1.5 m expelled + >0.5 m dead)...
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samuil
samuil
5. RE: Are you "yes we can" or was that all about you and not freedom
Jan 2 2009, 6:52 AM EST | Post edited: Jan 2 2009, 6:52 AM EST
"So you admit that you killed your own prime minister because some minority (IMRO) didn't approve his policies, right? What about the majority who voted for Stamboliyski? Were they traitors as well?

Anyway, it is pointless to discuss this issue since you cannot provide that the people whom you consider as Bulgarian actually felt Bulgarians. Some of the greatest leaders of the IMRO were Vlachs (and therefore not Bulgarians) like Pitu Guli. Those fellas preferred a Switzerland-like Macedonia rather than a Greater Bulgaria and IMRO's stance was ambivalent on the issue, until it was split to those who promoted the Bulgarian ideal against those who preferred a Macedonian state composed of Bulgarians, Greeks, Turks, Jews, Vlachs e.t.c. In the end, some were fooled to think that they are Macedonians of the Ancient breed!!!

You have to wake up and - much like your forefathers - realize some day that very few of those "Bulgarians" wished to be citizens of Bulgaria, and they realized that those without a national consciousness required some coercion to this end. This coercion was frequently violent - like the execution of patriarchist priests - and this violence turned the Greek state against you. Your mistake was the abandonment of the peaceful effort (education) and the adoption of violent solution against not only the Muslims, but also your fellow Christians. This was simply impossible, and all the Russian support in the world was not enough to help your cause.

The massacres and the expulsions of the populations of the former Ottoman empire are a very common sight in the modern Balkans, even as recently as the Yugoslav tragedy of the 1990's. The rise of nationalism out of a world that defined itself out of religious convictions for two millenia was an inevitable conclusion. Still, you cannot claim that you suffered more than the Armenians (1.5 m dead) or the Greeks (1.5 m expelled + >0.5 m dead)..."
?????
I'm not trying to play victim here.....
Yes i admit that IMRO suporters and members killed Stamboliiski. A primeminister in one of the hardest times for Bulgaria. He signed the humiliating Neuli threaty and after that he broke his pencil. The region of macedonia was bulgarian in its majority and it was the main goal of the bulgarian politics.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleksandar_Stamboliyski

Now you are speaking unprepeared! Thsi vlahs that you are writing about are very few. IMRO mainly 99% was bulgarian organisation. Remember, in this years the present day macedonians considered themselves bulgarians. Like 1200 years before that! They always was bulgarians!
I can provide that this people - present day macedonians and IMRO members WROTE, SPEAK AND FELT themselves AS BULGARIANS. Today they feel "macedonians" - whatever that feeling means! But it will be very difficult to "remind" to 2000000 people exiting 45 of comunist serb brainwashing what they are!
Look who is teaching me lesons:
Hey my greek friend! This priests of yours cried GUNS and they were spreading greek propaganda with one pourpose! To asimilate pure bulgarian population into greek one! And after that to ocupy pure bulgarian lands! Like you did with Voden, Lerin, Kostur, Kukush and many many other bulgarian cities and vilages in our former bulgarian teritories that today are in your posesion!
DON'T TRY TO DIG OLD SCELETONS! You need to lay low because you are one of the main reasons of our tragedies in the past!
Afcourse this priest were killed! Before they were killed, they suported the convesion of the bulgaeian population! And IMRO dod not alow that! Like Serbia took Nish and Pirot the same way!
DO you know about BATAK massakre, Perushtitsa masacre, Panagurishte massacre, Ilinden massakre, Kresna massakre!!?
DO you know how many milions expeled and dead are there?
We just don't play victim!
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samuil
samuil
6. RE: Are you "yes we can" or was that all about you and not freedom
Jan 2 2009, 6:54 AM EST | Post edited: Jan 2 2009, 6:54 AM EST
Especialy comparing the greek golden age in 20 century ocuping bulgarian teritories and killing and banishing milions of Bulgarians from aegeyan and thrace region!!!
And still today don't recognizing our minorities!
Why is that?
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samuil
samuil
7. RE: Are you "yes we can" or was that all about you and not freedom
Jan 2 2009, 7:00 AM EST | Post edited: Jan 2 2009, 7:00 AM EST
Considering your atitude and the protection of vardar macedonuism dovtrine i assume that you are FYROM citizen???
Especialy when you wrote the lie that the writen history and archeology can not provide evidence of the bulgarian descend of the people of vardar region!
It is the oposite! The "macedonians" can not write one single argument suporting their hypothesis!
In other hand - we have thousands of facts, artifacts, literature and CITATES OF THE LEADERS OF IMRO CLAIMING THAT THEY ARE BULGARIANS!
And the strategy of independend macedonian state has only one pourpose! After the liberation to be united in it's own will to mother Bulgaria to avoid the confrontation of the great powers for the bulgarian strugle for unification!
This is writen in the "ustav" of IMRO!
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samuil
samuil
8. RE: Are you "yes we can" or was that all about you and not freedom
Jan 2 2009, 7:12 AM EST | Post edited: Jan 2 2009, 7:12 AM EST
I'm sorry for the overreaction , but try to see our point of view. Today you don't have population in former teritories for wich you have to care. You suceeded to double your teritories taking mixed regions with majority of bulgarians. You WIN the wars in the past with your lobby and corect politics. We win the battles but we LOST on the politics field....
But this is our problem.....
But today we must make anything possible to return our lost natives in vardar region and in eastern serbia.
And from your side is correct to recognize our minorities ( especialy the bulgarian speaking pomaks- people with bulgarian culture) and to grant us axes to build ports on our former lands in eastern thrace.
This will be an act that will solve 100 year tension between our countries, because we were the side from wich was "taken" by force and the balance was destroied.
The balance must be restored......

And i think you from all the countries must help us to banish the macedonism doctrine from vardar region in order to solve your problem with them.....
And not to dig some one or two vlah voevods from IMRO.
For example - there was many bulgarian leaders that fough for greece and serbia in their rebelions against the turks, but that not make the greek and serb military organisation - bulgarian.......


Best Regards
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imaMacedonian
imaMacedonian
9. RE: Are you "yes we can" or was that all about you and not freedom
Jan 4 2009, 4:23 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 4 2009, 4:23 PM EST
thats right just like us the macedonians just becouse you tricked us into backing you in wqar then you turn your badcks on us well that's a fact ok but still its also a fact that we where then macedonians and still Today thats a fact Do you find this valuable?